Uncovered: Life Beyond
Join the conversations of Rebecca and Naomi, two ex-Amish Mennonite women who jumped the proverbial fence in their younger years and later experienced college as first-gen, non-traditional students. They discuss pursuing formal education while raising a family, navigating the hidden curriculum of academia, and other dimensions of reimagining a life beyond high-demand religion. Send your questions to uncoveredlifebeyond@gmail.com.
Uncovered: Life Beyond
58. She Did It! What Graduation Means in Midlife (And What Comes Next)
Celebrating Rebecca's recent college graduation has been a long time coming! In this episode, we reflect on the challenges and rewards she experienced as a midlife student as well as on the complicated transition to life after graduation.
• What it was like starting college without knowing all available options or having proper guidance
• How she learned to ask for help (including successfully advocating for scholarship funds)
• Her thoughts on navigating the tension between motherhood responsibilities and educational goals and how she consciously resisted passing along the tradition of parentification
• What she discovered about the common adage that "belief is an inside job"
• How she's finding the job market as a 50-year-old new liberal arts graduate
• The comfort she's finding in fiction, writing, and supportive relationships right now--as well as the tiny house community she's dreaming of building.
See the summa cum laude graduate in her regalia! (Summa cum laude means "with highest honors") https://www.facebook.com/share/p/16jAraWNb7/
Important Announcement: The Amish Descendant Scholarship Fund offers mentorship and financial support for anyone who left an Amish or Plain community with only an eighth-grade education and is now pursuing college. Apply now for funding for the 2025-2026 school year! (Application deadline is July 20, 2025.) Visit AmishScholarship.com to apply for mentorship or scholarships, or to donate to support others' educational journeys.
Not sure if you qualify? Reach out to them with your questions before you apply. Remember, they want to help!
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This is Rebecca and this is Naomi. We're 40-something moms and first cousins who know what it's like to veer off the path assigned to us.
Speaker 2:We've juggled motherhood, marriage, college and career, as we questioned our faith traditions while exploring new identities and ways of seeing the world.
Speaker 1:Without any maps for either of us to follow. We've had to figure things out as we go and appreciate that detours and dead ends are essential to the path Along the way, we've uncovered a few insights we want to share with fellow travelers.
Speaker 2:We want to talk about the questions we didn't know who to ask and the options we didn't know we had.
Speaker 1:So whether you're feeling stuck or already shaking things up, we are here to cheer you on and assure you that the best is yet to come. Welcome to Uncovered Life Beyond. Hello everyone, welcome back to Uncovered Life Beyond. This is Naomi and this is Rebecca, so today's episode is a little different and super special. I'm here with my cousin, co-host and real-life inspiration, rebecca, who just graduated college after seven years of part-time classes, raising kids, running a business, working jobs, being involved in her community and podcasting with me in the cracks between it all. So this milestone didn't come wrapped in ease or applause. In fact, it came after years of navigating a system that wasn't designed for people like her midlife moms, first generation students, people rebuilding from the ground up and yet she did it.
Speaker 1:So in today's episode, we're taking a moment to look back on the road that got her here, and then we're turning toward the future, because graduation isn't just a finish line. It's a complicated, powerful and sometimes disorienting beginning. So we're going to be honest about that part. We're going to talk about what's next for Rebecca, what it means to be a woman in midlife with a brand new degree and a lifetime of experience, and how we start imagining and then writing the next chapter when the ink is still wet from the last one. So grab a cup of coffee or a piece of celebratory cake and join our conversation today. Let's get into it. So, rebecca, what does it feel like to say I've graduated?
Speaker 2:Well, first of all, thank you for your kind words. You know, saying I graduated is both exciting and it's also scary. You know, when you're a student, the classes are set out there, the expectations are told. You get your syllabus and there's a goal, there's a grade to earn, and you check off the boxes and you complete it and then you get that grade and I think I'm going to miss that. I think I'm going to miss the structure that is wrapped in that. I'm also going to miss opening up a new textbook and learning about what's inside of it. But it also feels good to say you did it, I did it, I received the certificate and it feels like weird to now be in that category. It's like I have a bachelor's.
Speaker 1:It's crazy, is it a little like waking up when you're a kid and it's your birthday and you go I'm going to be double digits, and you wake up and the world still looks a lot the same as it did before. So when you think back, if you could go back and talk to yourself on day one of college, I just think about what a different life stage you and your kids and just everything we're in, and how far you and your kids and just everything we're in, and how far you and your family have come since then. What would you tell yourself then, as you were starting fresh, maybe not sure what to expect? What would you say to your earlier self?
Speaker 2:So, because I live in a really rural community, I didn't have a lot of options regarding colleges to attend, and even within the options I had, I didn't really know what all my options were, and I ended up picking my major from the selected literally five majors that the branch college that I was attending had, and I feel like it worked out for me. At the same time, I think I might have maybe asked more questions and worked a bit harder to ensure that I knew more of my options. The other thing I would have done was spent far less time questioning whether or not I was competent. Who knew that? The thing you worry about the most really is not an issue, and I think this is probably true for many, many people. It's easy to receive the message that, because you didn't quite get there, you're not competent or you're not qualified, and it has so little to do about that. It's far more about the systems that we have available to us.
Speaker 2:The other thing I went into college with the notion that this was something I was doing for me. I was going to do this for my younger self. I didn't set a lofty goal. I didn't have a grand plan. My goal was simply to do it, and sometimes I think it's easy to receive the message and maybe internalize the message that perhaps that was selfish and perhaps it was even frivolous or almost irresponsible and that I should have had a more specific plan. And I'm not saying that I would have necessarily done it differently, but I don't think I was prepared for those messages.
Speaker 1:Those messages are so unfortunate because, while college is a path to a career for many of us, especially if you started early in life, that's not the only reason to go to college. In fact, I think it's far from the best reason, and for me, I think it was a wonderful privilege that you could do it just because you wanted to, and I think that's the way, that's the ideal way to do college. That's the way college was originally. You're talking hundreds of years ago how it was intended to be done, not as job training, but just to learn for the sake of learning, and learning because you loved it, you know, and so I think it's wonderful. I do understand the pressures you're talking about because society tells us. We so often get the message that, oh, this is supposed to be about job training. But if we really value women's education, then education is a good in and of itself, whether or not it leads to a career.
Speaker 2:Well, and since when is the idea of being selfish or doing something for yourself a bad thing? Selfish or doing something for yourself a bad thing? I think most women, by the time they're 50, have invested in many, many people and in many, many different organizations, even other people's businesses. And since when is doing something for yourself selfish in a bad way? Why is that message projected?
Speaker 1:Exactly. That's so important. So you mentioned realizing that the thing that you were scared of most, or the thing you feared the most, turned out to be the least of your concerns. What were some of the biggest myths you had to unlearn about who belongs in college? What did you discover over those years?
Speaker 2:I think I always believed I belonged or I didn't spend much energy worrying about not belonging.
Speaker 2:I mean, you know you're in class with kids not even half your age and so quote, belonging is a bit suggestive, right, like like, yeah, it kind of define, or you need to kind of define what belonging means, I guess. Um, and of course there were events and situations that came up where other people may have been surprised at my age and my presence, but for the most part that wasn't really an issue and I really didn't care. I think maybe the saddest thing I observed was other young moms, moms younger than myself, who showed up for a semester or two and then I didn't see them again, and I'm sure some of them moved on to another part of the college. But I know there were some of them that simply didn't have the support systems to make it happen, and I think maybe that is something worth considering when you consider college. The ages of your kids, your family dynamics, really do matter and I hate to see situations where you're kind of set up to fail, and I think it's worth paying attention to that.
Speaker 1:Right. I think it's easy to get the message that how you do in college, how quickly you get there and how successful you are when you are there and how quickly you finish, that all this is contingent on your intelligence and on an individual's intelligence when, yes, it's so much of it, so much more of it has to do with the support systems available. And I think you know, the person who does go for a semester or two and then has to take time off and then gets back into it again, is every bit as much a hero, you know, deserves all the applause as much as someone who sails through because they're overcoming so much to get there. And I think we as a society, we tend not to give enough recognition for the effort that's required to overcome those obstacles.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and whether or not it's fair or right or good. When my kids were younger, I was responsible for their daily activities doctor's appointments, all the things and it was a lot, and our family's livelihood was not dependent on me getting an education. And I think had I tried to do it when they were younger, we would have all been frustrated. And something I thought a lot about was the fact that I didn't want to make my kids responsible for my education. They were involved, they were a part of it, but I didn't want to make them feel or make them resent or suffer from the work I was putting into it.
Speaker 1:Does that make sense? Oh, absolutely, and I think when we're you know, to anyone who's out there considering college wondering if this is something they should pursue, my recommendation would be don't ask if you're smart enough, but take a good look at your support systems around you, and I so admire the way that you didn't expect your children to support you. You know, or that to or to sacrifice for you and for your education, and I know, I know, how much you have been there for your kids all through, all through that. And I think this is not to say that mothers, this is not to diminish the overwhelming responsibility so many mothers carry, but this is to say that that support should be coming from other adults around us, not from our kids.
Speaker 2:And like there's, you know, a lot of talk about parentification and how that tends to crop up in larger families, religious families, that type of thing, and it's real. That is real, that's a real thing. But I think it can also happen in other situations and it is still parentification, whether or not it has any religious backing or whether or not it involves the family's goal to have a dozen kids, or whatever it is. Parentification is parentification and it's something that I wanted to be careful about and, at the end of the day, my kids are not responsible for my goals or for my dreams.
Speaker 1:I love that. I love that and not to get ahead of ourselves but I love that, at the same time, you make room for them to be involved when they want to be, and we'll get to more of that later. So, when you think back over these last seven years, was there a moment, or maybe more than one, when you wanted to, when you thought about quitting? What was that situation like and what kept you going?
Speaker 2:that I had to fight for scholarships. I remember one time and I think I had made the mistake I was late applying for scholarships and I don't know how I missed it, but I missed it. I usually follow those dates pretty faithfully and somehow I totally missed it. And I remember making a phone call and just saying you know I made a mistake, is there any scholarships that are still available to be able to apply for? And the answer I received was no, you missed the deadline. And I said that's okay, I understand, but I'm just going to have to take a semester off because I didn't want to incur debt.
Speaker 2:And it was kind of interesting because there was just this pause at the other end of the phone line and I guess it's not a line anymore, but anyway there was this pause and she goes oh, you can't take a semester off, look at your GPA. That's not okay, let me see what I can find. And sure enough they did find scholarship money. Okay, let me see what I can find. And sure enough they did find scholarship money. And that was the first time I realized I had no idea that that would be the response I would get. I seriously thought I would be taking a semester off.
Speaker 2:But that was the first time I realized how important it is to state what you need, be upfront about it. You don't have to beg, you don't have to plead, you don't have to, you know, throw a fit or anything. But who knew that there's always money available if you just ask? It was kind of shocking to me. And the other thing that I think I struggled with a little bit and part of this were my own issues, I'm sure but every so often I got into a situation where a professor perhaps made it somewhat clear that maybe I didn't belong in the classroom, and even then that didn't necessarily make me stop. It made me show up with even more energy and determination and I was going to be there for a whole semester and I was going to let him know I was there and I was going to let him know that he wasn't going to stop me. So I think maybe if we can take those situations that someone else isn't believing in, you figure out a way to prove them wrong. You don't need their approval to be there.
Speaker 1:I agree, I love that If you're there, you're there and you belong as much as anyone, and I love that point about asking for scholarships, but it's definitely worth it. And you had mentioned earlier about wishing you had asked more questions. You know, and I know that's the same. I feel the same way, like I didn't know what all my options were and I didn't know what questions to ask, and I think that's a very typical experience. You know, my recommendation for anyone who is in college or thinking about or not just college, but maybe starting a new career or something Like ask questions and don't feel, don't hold yourself to unrealistic expectations that say that you should know everything, and if someone makes fun of you for not knowing something, that's their problem, not yours.
Speaker 1:So, rebecca, you talked a little bit about not expecting your children to sacrifice for your education and for your dreams and how you continued caring for them throughout those years while you were in college. How would you say your identity as a mom shaped your experience as a student and vice versa. So, while there certainly can be a tension in terms of how you're going to spend your time and when you're going to get up early to do this or that or stay up late to do this or that. Were there other ways that being a parent while in school shaped your experience.
Speaker 2:You know I've been having this thought and I wonder how much in this case like an education, but I think it could be any means of bettering yourself. Therapy, you know, reading books, whatever it is. How much of that is as much for your kids as it is for yourself? And what if we would look at things in that light? How do we navigate goals and dreams? How do we navigate therapy ways to better ourselves without causing harm to kids?
Speaker 2:Wants to ensure that we don't pass on trauma to our kids. At the same time, I think there's a difference between passing on trauma and inconveniencing others, and I think I'm still mentally kind of thinking some of that through, and maybe that's where the tension lies. Maybe that's part of the tension, because I do think many of us grow up believing that we can't inconvenience others, that we have to be low maintenance at all costs, Like God forbid. I'm high maintenance, but being willing to live in that tension, I think, was important for me, and I think that when I am a student and have kids to think about, your success becomes a bit more large. Yeah, there's higher stakes, but you're obviously not doing it alone and so how can you do?
Speaker 1:it the central aim that everyone wins, that everyone's needs are met, everyone benefits. Did you discover anything about yourself that surprised you through this experience?
Speaker 2:talking. Perhaps this is part of what happens when kids are parentified because we're given responsibilities that we're not qualified for. A parentified child does not know how to take care of younger siblings, or they're taking care of younger siblings and something goes wrong, and then they're criticized and shamed for not doing it properly, when the truth is they don't have the skills, emotionally or physically, to do that. They are a sibling, they're not a parent.
Speaker 2:So a lot of those things combined, I think, often gave me the impression that I was somehow incompetent, that I always, always had to work just a little bit harder, that I needed to constantly be changing who. I was somehow incompetent, that I always, always had to work just a little bit harder, that I needed to constantly be changing who I was growing who I was, and I'm sure there was a lot of that. That was my inner critic. I'm sure there were some of the literal voices around me that were telling me that. But I remember realizing one day with a particular professor that he thought I was more than competent, and I guess that actually showed up several times and I almost remember like not laughing at myself but telling myself that perhaps I can kind of let go of that fear.
Speaker 1:That's a great feeling, and I'm so glad because, yes, if there's anyone in this world who's competent, it's you. What were some of the unexpected joys? Any other pleasant surprises or moments that you'll always remember? So?
Speaker 2:the community college that I was attending had their own little award ceremony and then the main campus had their own, you know, when you walk across stage and all that. And the local community college gave me a very kind award and basically it was like, you know, I don't know, I forget what it was called. I should pull it out, shouldn't I? Something about being, you know, not the model student of communications, but essentially that was what it was Very kind, very gracious. It was funny.
Speaker 2:When she was reading off the attributes of whoever was winning this, I remember thinking well, matt looked at me and he's like is that you? And I'm like, no, that's not me, but she sounds, sounds amazing. And you know, I had to think about the way other people view you, compared to how oftentimes we critique ourselves, and I think that those acknowledgments of who you are, but then also how you see other people, is so important. So, yeah, that was really kind of cool. And then also, when I did cross stage to get my diploma, as my name was called, my son, really loudly from the audience, was like that's my mom. And then there were voices that were like my mom, and then there were voices that were like yay, go mom. So that was kind of cool.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. I love that. I would love nothing more than to hear that or to read the speech or the introduction when you were given that award. I think you ought to get a hold of it. I'd love to read that if you do so. We've talked about the importance of support systems, and what were some of those support systems that really made a difference for you? Maybe it didn't make everything perfect, didn't smooth everything out, but helped and supported you along the way.
Speaker 2:You know, something I've been thinking a lot about recently is something I really believed in For years. I believed I know I said the words that belief in oneself was an inside job. I just believed that, even if the rest of the world didn't believe in me, I need to believe myself, and I just kind of bulldozed ahead and that was something. I need to believe myself, and I just kind of bulldozed ahead and that was something. So the actual phrase was that belief is an inside job. External affirmation is merely icing on the cake, and this was something I told myself. This is something I advocated for others, and while there's a grain of truth there, at the end of the day, we have to have our own internal belief system. I am also wondering if this is what people tell themselves when their support systems are failing, and I also wonder if this is what is said when someone in leadership is not wanting to develop relationships or to mentor in the way they should. None of us can expect the world around us to prop us up all day long, of course. Of course that's true. However, it is also true that the messages we receive from those closest around us tell us how others experience us, how others see us, and I don't think that's just the icing on the cake anymore. I think that's an important part of developing both as a kid and as an adult. It's an important part of relationships and it's a healthy part of relationships.
Speaker 2:And I think about those in my life who believed in me throughout this process, even when I didn't. They asked me questions, they invested themselves in part of my process. I got it from my family, I got it from you, naomi. I got it from sometimes random people, sometimes close friends, and I will forever be grateful for that. If that was simply icing, I need more icing. I mean like give it all, and I think we need to give that more generously to those around us. I think about kids who go into college who automatically have parents who believe in them. You know, I kind of think I don't care if my kid's playing soccer or making pottery or dancing. I think they are the best kid out there and some of us didn't have that growing up and I think maybe it's important that we, of course, give that to ourselves but also give that to others around us.
Speaker 1:I love that so much because we're not robots, self-contained robots. Because we're not robots, self-contained robots wandering around bumping into each other. As human beings, we need each other. We need that connection and reinforcement.
Speaker 2:We do, and all of us have a three-year-old and a 10-year-old and a 15-year-old alive and well inside of us. All of us have that, and pretending like that part of our life doesn't exist or isn't important, I think really creates a disconnect from the world around us and the people around us 100%.
Speaker 1:So, now that we've talked about some of those key insights, those important moments of the past seven years, let's talk about what's coming up next.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about what you're thinking about as you are looking ahead. I think when someone graduates from college in midlife, it's a mistake to think that they will do. You know that what happens after graduation is going to look just like it would if you were 21, 22, 23 years old graduating, and I think there's a different set of opportunities, there's a different set of resources, and I think that when it's not a perfect fit with what's conventionally expected of someone who's graduating as a young adult, it can create an extra set of challenges. However, I hope that our conversation here can bring hope to anyone and excitement and encouragement to anyone who is thinking about this kind of a transition in midlife, because I personally think there are some really really exciting advantages that also come with whatever is going to come next, when you are equipped with the life experience and the insight and learning that someone like you has. So how are you navigating this in between space this before, after the degree, but before the next thing feeling, where are you at in that?
Speaker 2:So, yeah, I wasn't quite prepared for this. I think I've spent a lot of time kind of feeling like a fraud and I'm also realizing that and you mentioned this it's kind of in some ways mentioned this. It's kind of in some ways I don't know if unfair is the right word to be a female stay-at-home mom for most of their years all of a sudden looking at quote a career. And while I was in college I liked my job, but I kind of did this job because I could do it part-time, the hours were flexible and I made good money. In hindsight I should have probably worked harder to get a quote career job that maybe wasn't as flexible and maybe didn't pay as much because it would have gave me a leg up on a quote career. I don't know, I'm just throwing that out there.
Speaker 2:The unfortunate thing is, wherever you are, you kind of have to do what works for you in the moment to survive too. So I don't say what I said there in judging anybody certainly not judging myself, because I had to do what I had to do. And also I went into college without and I think I mentioned this before opposed to someone who, say, goes into nursing or gets a specific degree to do a specific thing. But yeah, sitting here in this space has been a little uncomfortable and it's been a little frustrating because, as it turns out, I probably will need to be working more hours and finding more income.
Speaker 1:What are some of those messages that you're getting, maybe from employers or the world, your own inner critic, or maybe not even an inner critic, but like your kind of expectations of yourself? What are some of those messages that you're getting that are contributing to that sense, that uncomfortable sense that you're feeling?
Speaker 2:Well, somehow I am both underqualified, but yet I am overqualified, and somehow I have skills qualified, and somehow I have skills but not enough skills. Um and and sometimes I they it. The message is kind of given that you don't have, I don't have enough um experience. But then also people are afraid I'm using this job as a stepping stone, like that one kind of like, wow, I was not expecting that.
Speaker 2:And, honestly, the response I gave to that was like I was completely puzzled. But I'm like I am 50. I am tired. I am happy if I don't have one more stepping stone in my life. I had just never considered sending out an application with the idea of using it as a stepping stone. So I think, at the end of the day, I kind of feel like, and with these applications that I've sent out and I've sent out a bunch, I kind of feel like there's some kind of expectation that I just don't know about. And the funny thing is and I'll mock myself here I put on my resume that I'm intuitive and I all of a sudden was like laughing at myself and I'm like I think maybe I should take that off my resume because I have no idea what people are wanting. I have like no idea what people are wanting.
Speaker 1:Well, first let me say that I know from personal experience that the job market is a soul sucking place. If I hear sometimes about people who, you know, have a job lined up months before graduation, I have no idea what that's like. Well, okay, I guess I did, I guess, once that happened. But, generally speaking, I think we don't say enough about just how demoralizing the job market can be, and I have, at the risk of discouraging you further, I have sent you some of the headlines that I've seen about this year 2025, being a particularly difficult year for new grads. So I guess I would say, not just to you, rebecca, but to anyone out there who is job hunting right now please know it's not you. Please know your contributions are needed. Whether or not there is the funding available to compensate you fairly for that is another issue and that's a whole other rabbit hole we could go down. But the reality is that the job market sucks and we don't have many narratives to talk about this in our society without just blaming ourselves and thinking that we ourselves are incompetent, and I don't know how to fix this. I wish I did, except that this is kind of my cold comfort, dark encouragement whatever you call it that I offer to folks when I know they're heading into the job market.
Speaker 1:Is you know or like, say, maybe the academic job market, which is particularly harrowing? It's not you, the system sucks. And it's not you and your skills, your abilities, what you have to offer, is desperately needed. The fact that that position isn't, that you're not finding that position, you're not finding the right fit, all that it's a reflection of the system. It's not a reflection on you.
Speaker 1:And, as I've said to you, rebecca, that I think someone in your stage in life is going to have a lot more success. Your stage in life is going to have a lot more success working your personal networks and talking to people you know. The research shows that we're likely to get a job from someone who is, or through someone who is, an acquaintance, and so I think that throwing your resume into the stack of all the other resumes is not a great idea, even when you are early in your career, but it's definitely not an efficient way to get a job when you are someone with a lot of life experience, but maybe a fairly new degree or fairly new qualifications, in that sense. So I don't know if that's remotely helpful to anyone. But again, the bottom line is you don't suck the job market sucks.
Speaker 1:And work your network like talk to people, talk to people. Talk to people. I mean, I know well, I think you've experienced too, when you were working with, when you've, when you're talking with potential employers who know you personally, it's a different conversation than those who don't.
Speaker 2:Sometimes it is, but not always. Yeah, sometimes, but not always Fair.
Speaker 1:And fair, fair, and I'm not. I'm not suggesting that any of these are the easy ways. I'm just saying statistically, for most people, most of the time, it works that way and that if someone is, you know, applying to tons of jobs through any of the big job boards and not getting positive engagement, that again that approach does. The odds are not in your favor with that approach, within anyone's favor, and so working personal networks are usually much more productive. But that doesn't mean it's going to be easy.
Speaker 2:That's not what I'm saying right, because the thing is Engaging with people, you know, has its own hazard, and the lack of engagement or dismissal then becomes personal too. Level there. That I think doesn't get talked about either. And I just think parents, if you're listening, send your daughters to college, make sure they get a degree when they're young, make sure they get life experiences when they're young. And again, I don't regret getting my degree. I am so glad I did that and at the end of the day I did it for me.
Speaker 2:But I think if I had done it for any other reason but for myself, it would be a really difficult position to be in right now. People don't know what to do with a woman at 50 who has more or less been a stay-at-home mom with a new degree. It feels like people are unsure what to do with that. And again, again, I probably should have done things a bit differently. I should have probably got a job earlier and used it as a stepping stone. I probably should have done more of that type of thing. But again, you need to do what you need to do in order to survive and what makes sense in the moment.
Speaker 2:College that was more of a full-time position, more of a career-oriented position and I had a panic attack. I had to get my kids to the doctor. They were giving me a hard time with taking off for doctor's appointments. I mean, what is a mom supposed to do? And the funny thing is they liked me. They liked the work I did, but they wanted me to show up as if I didn't have a family. And I think about that experience often, because it's even like if you try, if you try to do that, you're supposed to show up as if you're not getting an education. You're supposed to show up as if you don't have a family. And there just isn't an easy way to win.
Speaker 1:Thank you for sharing that, because I think that's so true. And again, another example of how it's not you, it's the system, and and I have either spoken to or read about so many other women who are A in your situation or B in your situation, with years of professional experience, who are in a very similar place as far as finding a job that works for their life, and it sucks. I mean, the system's not working for so many of us. And I think, as we're sitting here recording, we happen to be in your living room instead of recording over Zoom, and I'm surrounded by pictures of the cutest babies and toddlers and kiddos ever that you were raising, and all we can do is what we can do in the moment with the information and the resources we have available at the time, and you knocked it out of the park. I want you to know that.
Speaker 2:Thank you and you know, at the end of the day, I don't really regret the decisions I did make.
Speaker 1:I don't know.
Speaker 2:We just have to be kinder with the expectations we put on other people, we put on ourselves and I don't know. We just have to be kinder with the expectations we put on other people we put on ourselves and I don't know how to navigate that. I don't know how to hold those tensions. I am working on it. I think I'm learning better how to do that. But yeah, the frustration is there, it's real, and I am to the point and I do have a job position I am taking and the boss that I'm talking to is amazing going to a clinic that's like five hours from here throughout this summer for some chronic illnesses that they've been dealing with and I, because of my other job experience, was up front with him and I'm like this is the reality of my summer.
Speaker 2:If it's going to be a problem, then you probably need to just go and find someone else or hire someone else, Because at the end of the day and I think this is the unfair reality at the end of the day, a mother, especially, is expected to take care of their kids, attend doctor's appointments, kids attend doctor's appointments, and not that Matt doesn't help with that, but it often falls on me unless I specifically say otherwise. And I just don't know how moms juggle that. I mean, Naomi, you've done this for years, juggling the doctor's appointments, juggling the school stuff, juggling all of it, and I don't know. Somehow we have to come up with a better system.
Speaker 1:I couldn't agree more. So when you are, you're thinking about A. You've just run this marathon, you've got the awards, but now here's life after the marathon, and you're in this transition period of trying to figure out what that's going to look like. We've talked about what so many of those challenges are, and challenges that many of us share. So, in the context of all this, who or what is giving you energy and hope during this time and when you envision your life, say, two years from now, what is giving your life meaning? What is giving you energy that is pulling you toward that moment?
Speaker 2:So I kind of laugh. For many years, many, many years, I really bought into the whole notion of junk in, junk out, which, translated to you, only read Christian books or good self-help books, or else that was the only way to get good out, and what a waste anyway. What a waste. I look at my time that I spent in that space and I just think, oh, my goodness, lighten up. But anyway, right now I've been reading fiction books a lot, books that have absolutely no value in my life, but they give me a place to live, a place to disappear and live through them and relax. But the funny thing is, even within fiction books there's a lot of good stuff in it, and so, for whatever that's worth, I've been reading fiction books a lot, a couple of weeks actually. Sometimes I've also been writing a lot.
Speaker 2:Oddly enough and I think I've heard other writers talk about this too when you're slightly depressed you almost write better sometimes, which I think is fascinating. But then close family and friends have been absolutely life-giving. And the other thing that's kind of nice at this age is, you know we can now tap into emotional skills that you know work, and at this point in life you kind of know nothing is forever. Sucky stages come. Sucky stages go Success come. Sucky stages, go Success. Whatever that is comes and it goes, and even though perhaps you're not always feeling successful, it doesn't mean you're an absolute loss either.
Speaker 2:So just having the benefit of age or call it maturity, whatever that has been kind of helpful it's been very helpful and just the continuing of reparenting myself that 12-year-old is still afraid we're not going to make it, that 12-year-old is still afraid that we're getting lost in all of life, but reminding them that we're going to be okay. And not only are we going to be okay, we're going to figure out, we're going to do more than okay, we're going to thrive. It has been helpful and just tapping into the belief that I give to my kids and allowing myself to experience that as well.
Speaker 1:I love that and I think that emotional intelligence that you're talking about there is such such a powerful resource that many of us have learned by midlife. So I'd love to hear where would you like this to take you in two years? Like two years kind of arbitrary timeframe, but what do you hope your life looks like? Or what are the? What are the big dreams? Cause I know you, you don't do anything halfway. What are some things you're hoping for? Because not that I really believe in manifesting, but hey, can't hurt, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, manifest that shit. So I'm kind of in a situation right now where mama needs to make some money and long term. My final class that I had to do to graduate, actually, I had to develop a business plan and I remember being surprised at how impressed my professor was with the business plan, and it includes a tiny house, community and a place where people can come, people can go, but a safe place. And I think in many ways the community that I envision building isn't just a safe place for other people, it's a safe place for me too, and maybe it's something I want for myself, but I want to be able to give to others. I want a quiet space to be, to put around in a garden if I want to, but also space to write and to build connections, but with a sense of purpose and a sense of freedom.
Speaker 1:I love that vision so much and for so many reasons. A I think you'd be amazing at it and at developing something like that and welcoming people into it. And also, the rising housing costs are making life difficult for so, so many of us, and I think that we need more ideas like this one in the world to help us think about how housing and community can be made more accessible for more people. It's such an important need. So, before we wrap up today, we wanted to make a quick announcement about a quick but important announcement about the Amish Descendant Scholarship Fund and a quick but important announcement about the Amish Descendant Scholarship Fund. We met one of the founders of this fund last summer at the symposium at Elizabethtown and we'll be putting a link in the show notes to the website.
Speaker 1:The message from the fund is for anyone who's left an Amish or a Plain community with only an eighth grade education, who is now either trying to find their way to college or finding their way through college. The Amish Descendants Scholarship Fund can help anyone who fits that description in a couple of ways. One through mentorship matching up with a mentor who grew up Amish or Plain and has chosen to pursue education and they can offer some guidance, encouragement, support, moral support. You know whether someone is wondering if college is for them or maybe they're already in it and to be involved with that mentorship program, please visit AmishScholarshipcom to apply not only for the mentorship but then also for the scholarship. I think the scholarship deadline is for this year is toward the end of July, that's 2025. Now if you're not attending college but maybe you want to support folks who are, we invite you to consider donating to the Amish Descendant Scholarship Fund through the link on their site and so that also will be linked to the show notes. Your contributions to this fund could make a massive difference in someone's life.
Speaker 1:I know that the fund helps support Rebecca through part of her education, and we all know the world needs more Rebecca's and fewer barriers. So, rebecca, you've graduated, you've crossed this massive threshold that you built plank by plank, often while carrying others across with you, and I hope you know with your whole self that this moment matters. And to our listeners, if you're in the middle of a long road, if your dreams are taking the scenic route, or if you're starting over later than you thought you would, you're not behind, you're on your own timeline and you are worth showing up for yourself again and again. Let this episode be proof that it's never too late to choose yourself to finish what you started or to start something completely new. Rebecca, thank you for sharing your story with us. You're not just a graduate, you're a mapmaker. So until next time, friends, keep going, keep dreaming and make your own path.
Speaker 2:Thank you for spending time with us today. The resources and materials we've mentioned are linked in the show notes and on Facebook at Uncovered Life Beyond.
Speaker 1:What are your thoughts about college and recovery from high demand religion? We know you have your own questions and experiences and we want to talk about the topics that matter to you. Share them with us at uncoveredlifebeyond at gmailcom. That's uncoveredlifebeyond at gmailcom.
Speaker 2:If you enjoyed today's show and found value in it, please rate and review it on your favorite podcast app. This helps others find the show While you're there. Subscribe to our podcast so you never miss an episode.
Speaker 1:Until next time stay brave, stay bold, stay awkward. Thank you.
